TIVO ALERT: Just a reminder (because your season pass won't notice it) that NBC is running its two-hour Women of SNL special tonight, and Tom Shales would like you to know that Colonel Angus will be resting his head at Shady Thicket once more. No word on whether we'll see Victoria Jackson singing upside down, evidence that Julia Louis-Dreyfus was funny while on the show, or discussion of Nora Dunn's feminist stance in leaving the show when Andrew "Dice" Clay was booked to host.
Provocative statement of the day: Maya Rudolph is the most talented woman to appear on SNL, and Tina Fey the most important to its history. Discuss.
I don't know how you measure importance to history, etc, but that won't prevent me from casting my vote for Gilda. Roseanne Roseannadanna and Emily Litella . . dayenu.
ReplyDeleteThis is my heresy, but I never quite got why Gilda Radner was supposed to be that funny. I've seen all the classic skits and ... they just don't click with me.<span> </span>
ReplyDeleteI was always partial to Cheri Oteri, who seems to have become the forgotten female of the time period, or at least only remembered for the Cheerleader sketches.
ReplyDeleteSpeaking of Cheri Oteri--did anyone else see her 'now' clip in one of the previews and GASP at the amount of work she has done. It was a very short clip, and she was almost unrecognizeable.
ReplyDeleteRudolph probably has a greater breadth of talent with the singing and ability to do drama, but Amy Poehler may be a deeper comic talent.
ReplyDeleteFey as first female head writer is absolutely up there, but I'm a little hesitant because I think you can count the non-Update sketches she performed in when she was a cast member on two hands, and the (apocryphal?) "you need to lose weight before I'll put you on the air" story may have imapcted that.
What I liked about Gilda Radner was her inherent likeability. This may sound weird to say, but you don't often get the sense from comedians that they'd be "nice."
ReplyDeleteI recently watched a lot of uncut season 1 shows on Netflix Watch Instantly. Go look at the one where Candice Bergen hosts - there's a lovely sketch with her and Gilda, both sitting on stools, just having a conversation. It's funny and sweet and touching and really made me like Gilda that much more.
FWIW: this is one of my favorite Gilda sketches: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFO_nklfLds Which might explain why I was very pleased by the Les Jeunes des Paris sketch from the Emma Stone episode.
Dang, you're right: http://www.hulu.com/watch/188798/saturday-night-live-cheri-oteri#s-p2-sr-i1 She looks like the forgotten half-sister of Rachel Ray and Ashley Tisdale.
ReplyDeleteRats - I am guest, both here and below on the Cheri Oteri comment.
ReplyDeleteProvocative indeed. What did Rudolph do on the show to justify that kind of praise? I have trouble recalling a single sketch in which she was featured.
ReplyDeleteI don't think it's heresy, Adam, although I'm a huge Gilda fan - comedy may be the most subjective art there is, and if you don't get it, you don't get it. That's fine.
ReplyDeleteFor me, it's Gilda's incredible ability to make me laugh without cheap shots, without insulting anyone, without cursing. She created characters whose voices I can hear in my head, who were fully defined, and who never got old to me. Her ability to portray genuinely decent people and still make them funny seems a nearly lost art.
Some of what I love about her is also what I love about Mike Meyers' Simon character. Tons of smart commentary, while still exceedingly funny, at least to me.
I agree with the Rudolph vs. Poehler point. I'm not sure I've ever really laughed at anything Rudolph did (except maybe the first time she did Whitney Houston), though I can recognize her talent. Poehler can't sing or dance, but she had one of the highest sketch batting averages (for me) of anyone ever on SNL.
ReplyDeleteOprah, Whitney, Donatella, Beyonce.<span> </span>
ReplyDeleteAnd often while rocking one leg, it should be noted.<span> </span>
ReplyDeleteYeah, it's not even a contest between Rudolph and Poehler. As I think I've said here before, Poehler's range is incredible: she can do crazy like Andy's sister, but she's an even better straight woman. She's probably the best female improviser in the country, certainly in NYC. And beyond SNL, she's a very influential figure in live comedy, something that Rudolph isn't. Rudolph doesn't perform live comedy since SNL, that I've ever heard.
ReplyDeleteI'll pass on the Maya Rudolph question, because I think it depends what you mean by "talented." I don't think she's the funniest, by any stretch of the imagination -- and any other talents on a comedy sketch show seem somewhat irrelevant.
ReplyDeleteAs for importance, while Tina certainly qualifies for consideration, I've got to give the nod to Gilda and her female colleagues in that first Not Ready for Prime Time cast. It was their ability to hold their own with the men that paved the way for everyone who followed, including Tina. If they were nothing more than window-dressing or lesser supporting players, it would have been tough for any woman to break through in succeeding years.
As for the current cast, I think Nasim Pedrad is well on her way to being one of the best female performers in the show's history. Her impressions are good (even her Barbara), and she throws herself fully into every character that comes her way. The one I'm actually a little disappointed in is Abby Elliot. She was very, very funny in her first season but now it seems like she's barely on the show. The cast is a little crowded, but I expected her to rise to the top pretty quickly.
ReplyDeleteJust a thought: I forget who it was, but an ex-SNLer was asked what makes a great cast member and the person said that it had a lot to do with the effort that someone puts in when they're NOT starring a given sketch. A lot of sketches require bit parts that aren't going to get a ton of laughs, and it's easy to check out when you're playing a waiter or some other straightman character.
What you're talking about is evident in the "What Up With That" sketch. It's ostensibly a Keenan Thompson sketch, but Jason Sudeikis and Bill Hader (both in non-speaking bits) are two of my favorite parts.
ReplyDeleteNone of which strike me as particularly memorable or funny. I mean, they'll be talking about the Palin sketches in the history books. Not sure a good-but-not-great Oprah impression can compare.
ReplyDeleteAnd if you factor in non-SNL work, which is as good a measure of talent as any, there really is no way Rudolph can compete with Poehler or Fey.
I think someone mentioned it here, but it's the little hop Sudeikis does before he starts dancing that kills me every time. There are my friends, then there are people who don't like "What Up With That?".
ReplyDeleteThat would be me.
ReplyDeleteI'd put the Oprah's Favorite Things up there among the best, and all the Beyonce/Prince Show skits are solid.
ReplyDeleteI'm fine with putting Poehler over Rudolph.<span> </span>
At the same time, Nasim Pedrad, Jenny Slate (last season), and Vanessa Bayer (this season) have put in yeomen's work as the background singers/dancers. It's a thankless task, but it's all the texture which makes What's Up With That? stand out,
ReplyDeleteMost talented to me, in terms of how they were used on the show (so my answer is prejudiced toward those who were used consistently, something which dings Rudolph) has to be Jane Curtin. Am I caveating the question to death? Almost certainly.
ReplyDelete<span>Finn, you ignorant slut. I suppose you'd like to conduct our foreign policy the way you conduct your private life, hopping from bed to bed with anyone that can do you some good.</span>
ReplyDeleteI'll just note that I am now red-faced at my desk trying not to laugh too loud. Well played.
ReplyDelete