THE TALKING DEAD: Apropos of the return of The Walking Dead, if there is one thing on a television show that sends my thumb straight to the fast-forward button, it's somebody in a church talking to God. I don't care if it's President Bartlet or Sheriff Keira Knightley's Secret Admirer, it just never rings true.
Other than that, with The Walking Dead, you know what you're getting, and you can't get anything else. Spoiler alert: there are zombies, and the tension is getting to people, and you alternate between attrition and non-elimination episodes. It's basically exactly like a season of Survivor, except with decaying bodies instead of tropical kitsch. I like zombie stuff, but the moment you play the zombie card, you've painted yourself into a pretty tight corner, creativity-wise. What are the plot moves you can make? There's (a) Another Person Just Died; (b) We're Running Low on Supplies; (c) Battlestar Pegasus (otherwise known as We Just Ran Into Another [Band of] Survivor[s]); (d) Is This a Cure? No It Is Not; (e) We're Surrounded; (f) We All Hate Each Other; (g) Survivors Get It On; (h) Birth in a Hellhole; and (i)(1) Go Gently Into that Goodnight or (i)(2) Is This a Cure? Yes It Is. Am I missing anything?
Perhaps heroic sacrifice by previously evil (though vaguely sympathetic) survivor?
ReplyDeleteNot to mention the "we have to go back" callback
Sorry Isaac, but I've got to disagree. "Two Cathedrals" is probably my favorite TV episode of all time, and that scene helps make it.
ReplyDeleteYou forgot "someone got bit and was hiding it, and we don't want to mercy kill them." (A variant of a, but a significant one.)
ReplyDelete(j) Yeah, I've Been Bitten, But I'm Going to Beat This Thing!
ReplyDeleteMatt and I think alike.
ReplyDeleteDoes the show roughly follow the books? If so, where are we, in terms of issues? I just read the first book last night (the books come in all sizes, so to be clear I mean the smallest denomination -- I think it collected three or four issues)? (By the way, I'm really impressed by the economy of the storytelling in the comics.)
ReplyDeleteTwo Cathedrals is my favorite episode of all time, and the scene does help make it. But I'll also agree that it's pretty frikken melodramatic. (Also, as someone who has never held faith the way that Jed does, I think I probably can't comment on the realism of someone talking with God in their place of worship.)
ReplyDeleteAgree to disagree. That scene may work for a lot of people, but to me it's so bad it's comic. "Damn you, God! Here is a quote from somebody that will really put you in your place! Why do you have to be such a dick? E pluribus unum! I shake my fist at you!" With that and the clumsy flashbacks, I really do not understand the appeal that episode has. I think people are just blinded to the hackiness by the surprise and by their love for Mrs. Landingham.
ReplyDeleteRe "the realism of someone talking with God in their place of worship," what I've always thought about prayer is also true about arguments with God. People tend to use their voices when they want other people to hear; they tend not to when they want God to hear. Which I guess is another reason why these scenes convey the wrong thing to me.
ReplyDeleteWell, this is what I'm saying. If you're THAT committed to your faith, and THAT powerful in the temporal realm, and feeling THAT sorry for yourself and THAT embattled, it's not hard for me to imagine you (well, not YOU, but you know what I mean) doing something THAT narcissistic, and doing it out loud, even if you'd normally be more interior. (But, as I said above, it's a melodramatic scene.)
ReplyDeleteAlso, I should say: I've encountered others who really dislike Two Cathedrals, so I'm not suggesting there's anything wrong with that. It definitely trafficks in a sort of magical-realist melodrama that one could argue departs from the show's overall tone.
ReplyDeleteI haven't watched The Walking Dead, but those plot moves would definitely fit "Falling Skies," especially if you substitute (g) Is this a way to fight the robot aliens? for (i) is this a cure?
ReplyDeleteand there's always (k) Suddenly There's a Zombie That's Doing Something Different (thinking, talking, running, etc)
ReplyDeleteAlien movies/series are a little different, because you have the "collaborator" options. With zombies, those plot angles are typically foreclosed. Either you're flesh-hungry or you're not. No real middle ground.
ReplyDeleteSomeone's Shocking Backstory is Revealed.
ReplyDeleteWhere do the plants fit in?
ReplyDeleteor "That's my (family member)! Should we keep them alive until we find a cure? For how long? Who will do 'the deed' when it's inevitably time?
ReplyDeleteFollowed, in some circumstances, by (k)(1): "Don't Kill It! We Should Study This Zombie, Who Will Reveal To Us Truths About The Human Condition!"
ReplyDeleteAnd then (k)(2): "You Damned Scientists Are The Ones Who Got Us Into This Mess In The First Place!"
ReplyDeleteThe variation on (h), of course, is "Birth in a Hellhole - but What Is It?" (see, e.g., Dawn of the Dead remake)
ReplyDeleteThe showrunners past and present have said that there will be some plotlines that follow the books and some that do not (or at least not slavishly). Basically, they have Kirkman's OK to tell the story for TV however it works best. As one who hasn't read the books, I'm just enjoying the ride.
ReplyDeleteI do think that the thinking zombie is a very controversial notion in the world of zombie fiction. I know there is a novel about sentient zombies, but the evolution of zombies would suggest that what causes zombiehood is mutable, which implies that it is alive, which is the opposite of zombie. I don't buy the zombie virus as a literal virus. So I reject zombies that can think or talk, except to say "huuuhhh, braiiiiiiiins." Incidentally, zombie shouting and mumbling really shouldn't exist either. To should or moan, you need to have air in your lungs. Why would a zombie have air in its lungs? I get that the ship has sailed on this one, but zombies really shouldn't be making any aspirated sounds.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, Adam C's (k)(2) is really part of the biggest story I missed, which is Whose Damned Fault Is This Anyway? Another one I missed, probably because I hate it, is Trying to Preserve Normalcy Amid this Zombie Bullshit.
The list of plot choices at this point seems fairly broad to me. Certainly no worse than a lot of sitcoms and procedurals that we've been watching for the past 20 or 30 years.
ReplyDeleteReally, which is more limiting -- keeping a desperate group of people one step ahead of the flesh-eating monsters, or finding a new way to cleverly piece together the evidence to catch a murderer?
People also tend not to speak on film, in front of stagelights, guided by directors, reciting scripts and wearing make-up when they want God to hear. But, like having those arguments play out without words, losing those production bits would make for bad TV.
ReplyDeleteThat's a straw man argument. Filmed realism is about what shows up on camera.
ReplyDelete<span>
ReplyDelete...or new ways to postpone telling us who is the Mother?
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There's also the "wow, the world really has gone bad" moments. These may be more setting than plot, but it's always an easy thing to show an elementary school gone bad, or a county fair gone bad, or a church pot luck gone bad. This is true in almost any post-apocolyptic movie, of course.
ReplyDeleteI tthhought I wass sppeecialll...
ReplyDelete--Doc Potterywood
What would be the best "___ gone bad" moments? Some thoughts:
ReplyDeleteCongress
Mommy & Me class
Porno shoot
Occupy protest (because how could you tell the zombies from the protesters?)
Rhythmic gymnastics meet
Not a straw man. Whatever you think of Two Cathedrals, it would have been leagues worse had it featured President Bartlett pacing silently through the church while a Martin Sheen voiceover relayed his thoughts. People speak to God out loud on TV because it plays better on TV than voiceovers, italicized subtitles, thought bubbles and/or telepathy. If you are complaining about characters arguing/talking with God generally, or in a church specifically, as cliche or ridiculous, there is a point to discuss there. But, if the problem is in that these arguments are not ringing true because they are verbal, you're just sparring with the limitations of filmed realism.
ReplyDeleteThere's always 'Zombie Camp One Is Attacking Zombie Camp Two, and We're Caught in the Middle!', and its sister, 'Zombie Camp One Is Being Attacked; We Have to Protect Them Even Though We Can't Trust Them!'
ReplyDeleteAlso, I point to my Baptist Upbringing for making me more willing to accept Characters speaking to God out loud. Doing it in the National Cathedral, probably not, but talking to God in general, fine.
ReplyDeleteOf course, I always saw the subtext of Two Cathedrals as being, 'I thought I was the all-powerful one here. Where do you get off, being God and all?' In that instance, with Bartlet coming from a point of view of being a God, I'm okay with him speaking out loud to this other, lesser deity called 'God'.
Let us also bear in mind that the climax of the episode involves Bartlet talking to a ghost. Honestly, it's utterly ludicrous when you think about it, but just so well performed by Sheen and Joosten and that final "Brothers In Arms" sequence just so well put together that it keeps it from tipping into utter absurdity.
ReplyDelete- Heavy metal concert
ReplyDelete- live sporting event (World Series? Football game?)
- Real zombies attacking a horrifically timed Zombie March / Parade (we have one in Boston every year, i'd assume other cities have them as well)
- or a vampire Live Action Role Play event.
It's a straw man because the argument that it's unrealistic for Martin Sheen to be wearing makeup and reciting words in front of a camera has nothing whatsoever to do with the problem I have with the device. Those are all things you are not supposed to perceive. You are supposed to perceive that Martin Sheen is speaking out loud instead of in his head. And I'm not sparring with the limitations of filmed realism, I'm accepting them. You can't have somebody shout at God sincerely without abandoning the pretense of realism. That is a limitation of filmed realism. You can't just say "well, shouting at God would never happen, but it is the only way to deliver this killer speech that I've been working on, so we'll go with that." And by the way, I agree that voice over would have been worse. So shouting is bad, voice over is worse, subtitles would be even worse. May I suggest not doing the scene at all?
ReplyDeleteBut anyway, that's not my only problem with the scene. Even if I could get past the fact that he is speaking out loud instead of in his head, it's a stupid speech. It's written like an essay, not a speech, with that embarrassingly dumb thing with the Graham Greene quote stuck in the middle of it, and it's so petulant, so "why me?" Seriously, the Graham Greene thing. "God, here is this quote from Graham Greene, which I believe is wrong! Point for me!"
re the Live Action Role Play event, zombies vs. Twilight fans would be awesome and confusing.
ReplyDeleteI have an exception to your church rule:
ReplyDelete<span>"Thank you, Lord, for letting Buckley win. I know that it was nothing short of a miracle, and I thank you for that miracle. I know you truly are an all-powerful God to let such a crap team win."</span>
Romero's films resolutely don't answer the Why. Night of the Living Dead is the only one that even dances around the question, with the only hint being a news report that alludes to radiation from a crashed space probe. The Russo/O'Bannon films (the Return of the Living Dead series, which first brought us zombies who say "braiiiinns") go biological with the cause, with the "virus" concept popping up even later (and don't get me started on 28 Days/Weeks Later - those ain't zombie movies, though they owe a large debt to them).
ReplyDeleteAll of this reminds me, I really need to see Zombieland.
Rush hour subway car
ReplyDeletePhiladelphia's Naked Bike Ride
Gordie's pie eating contest story in Stand By Me
MTV's Death Valley (which has actually been pretty enjoyable) did a porno shoot gone bad with a werewolf.
How about (a)(1): I just killed someone that I thought was a zombie, but I was wrong.
ReplyDeleteThat one is called "Bill Murray."
ReplyDelete